"Like proponents of the Prosperity Gospel, Rick Warren is so in line with the American way of life that his purpose-driven model of life is too American, not equipped to transform American society or even to address the Narcissism and self-centeredness that plagues America and western society today." (pg. 32)
"Both [Osteen and Warren] minimize the role of grace in providing the good life (they are almost Pelagian in stressing our works) and correspondingly have a weak conception of sin. ... [They] both agree that you have to do something in order to be blessed. Warren only speaks of faults, weaknesses, or mistakes, and Osteen only refers to barriers of the past, mistakes, or 'disappointments.' Neither of them actually refers to Romans 7:14-24 and original sin." (pg. 43,44)
"The real problem with our condition . . . is that people do not want to admit they are sinners, and will not unless confronted with the Law and Christ." (pg. 47)
Brave sinning is not "permission 'to do your own thing.' Rather, [it's] a word of permission to do God's 'thing' joyously and with reckless abandon." (pg. 64)
"For Luther... joy is not based on ourselves or our situation in life. It is based solely on the hope that Christ's work provides." (pg. 78)
"The brave sinner is someone so totally dependent on God that he or she looks at life, even the most important projects, as play. They are play, because what we do has no ultimate significance unless God makes it significant." (pg. 81)
Any discussion? Any debate?
If interested, see previous posts for more information and quotes from this book by Mark Ellingsen.
6 comments:
"Like proponents of the Prosperity Gospel, Rick Warren is so in line with the American way of life that his purpose-driven model of life is too American, not equipped to transform American society or even to address the Narcissism and self-centeredness that plagues America and western society today."
I think that's harsh, to be honest with you. I want to say (I'm too lazy - how American) to go find my book) that the first sentence in chapter 1 of that book says "It's not about you, it's about God".
Rick Warren's concept of having purpose makes sense to me. I don't believe the God that talks about intricately knitting me together and knowing every single one of my days in Psalms, (before I was even born) is in the business of creating without purpose. I believe I was created for purpose.
The first purpose Rick identifies is we were made to for God's pleasure. It's all about our purpose of intimacy with Christ, true worship. Is there some kind of selfishness that can come in putting God first?
The second, we were made to be part of God's family. I believe Scripture is very clear about the body of Christ. Using the physical body as an example, God clearly shows us how important it is that we are actively a part to help His church function as a whole.
Third purpose, we were created to become like Christ. Anyone want to argue that's too American? I think that's about as far as we can get from current day American. We were created to accept Christ and have His Spirit in us to help us become like Christ.
#4 - We were made to serve. Uh, yeah. As someone in ministry, I can't agree with Rick more. I also think it's far from what's the norm or easy or usual. The usual is to have others do for us. We were made to serve as Christ did. He washed the feet of others. He served them. He made the ultimate sacrifice by giving up His own life.
And lastly, we were made for a mission. It speaks for itself that Jesus challenged us with the Great Commission. We are to go. We are to share. We are to make disciples.
Now, if someone wants to nitpick or get annoyed at another pastor's style, I suppose they can. God hasn't called all of us to be clones. If someone doesn't like Rick Warren's style of putting a name to the instructions we've been given, okay. Then don't read the book, or don't use it in small groups. I don't think Rick Warren's book is selfish or that it is in line with the American way which I think is self driven. Having purpose is not selfish, it's about not wasting our life. It's about being a good steward of our time, our talents, abilities, resources, and life. I'd say that's a pretty great thing!
Hmm, I'd love to discuss, but I've never read the books. I was warned off The Purpose Drive Life early on (very saccharine and simplistic, no emphasis on having to take responsibility for our own sins, and the theology is bad - at least from a Catholic point of view). But I'm enjoying this other book, through your quotes.
I pretty much agree with Carmen. While I haven't read the book "Sin Bravely" I feel like the two thing are coming at the same object from different angles. Warren wants me to know that I am made for God and his pleasure. Ellington wants me to know that God is holy and I am made for his pleasure.
Well, if I am taking Warren seriously, then I could never leave my faith alone at 'works'. If I am to live for God's glory that means dying to self day-to-day. That means I really need to self evaluate the actions in my life - attitudes and behaviors that are not pleasing to God and prevent me from doing my part to make disciples of all men.
Sin IS important. We DO have to acknowledge our utter dependence on God. Our problem IS original sin, that I am doomed to sin without Christ. But in reading Warren's book I never got the sense that he was ignoring sin.
You wrote: "He evokes more of a community-minded outlook where the poor are taken better care of as opposed to our self-centered, individualistic (dare I say capitalistic?) society where we seek to prosper ourselves by working longer and harder and using people in the process." But it seems to me that if we are really doing what Rick Warren says, then we have to do just that. If the first thing is putting God first, that means first in ALL things. If we as a church were really doing that then I am convinced we'd be doing much more in our communities.
Just because something is simple doesn't mean it can't be deep. Jesus says that this simple statement sums up the Law and the prphets: love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul and strenght and love your neighbor as yourself. That's crazy simple. But yet God *himself* said that it summed up the Law!
we do has no ultimate significance unless God makes it significant."
this was powerful!!
I believe that for myself.
Carmen, thanks for the summary of Rick Warren's book. Now I don't have to read it for myself. ;) I should have prefaced everything by sharing that the author complimented Warren quite a bit. His "beef" was that Warren's philosophy appealed to Americans because it focused on our duty (and we are duty-driven and hate to label ourselves as dependent). He says, "Brave sinners are a lot more dependent on God than those driven by purpose." I think he believes a purpose-driven life is too focused on what I am going to do for Christ instead of depending on GOD to do through you. I'm sorry if that doesn't make sense. I agree that everything you wrote in your summary sounds fantastic! :) I appreciate you sharing all that.
Joni, thank you for what you wrote. Always good stuff from you!
"If the first thing is putting God first, that means first in ALL things. If we as a church were really doing that then I am convinced we'd be doing much more in our communities."
So true! We could really make a HUGE difference in this world if we truly loved and served as Christ showed us.
Amber, thanks! I'm glad you've enjoyed it. I kept thinking you'd protest how depraved he made us sound. ;)
Angela, good to see you! :)
Thank you all for your wonderful comments!
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